Fibromyalgia and CST

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Vita
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Fibromyalgia and CST

Post by Vita » Sun Jun 01, 2008 5:30 am

I currently have a client who has Fibromyalgia. Normally I use Lymphatic Drainage (LDT) with some success, however she is very excited about CST and yesterday when she came in for her appointment she requested I use CST for her 30 minute appointment. I would love some feedback on her session from anyone who has treated FM with CST and any direction you can give me.

I have had CST 1 and won't be taking CST 2 until October, so I am limited in my knowledge and usage. During her appointment I did:
Still Point
Diaphragms
L5-S1 Decompression

She began feeling great - until I got to the Occipital Cranial Base - when she began to feel pain again in the tender points superior medial sacrum. I went 20 minutes over in session time attempting to calm them down (holding pelvic diaphragm) so she wouldn't leave in pain. When she did leave, pain was gone but she had an "awareness" in the same area, however, her upper body felt great- very relaxed. The CS rhythm did change. While her pain is in the right side, her left CS rhythm was choppy and shortened. By the end, both sides were much better quality and more asymmetric although fairly short.

This said I have several questions...Was there something I did to cause the pain in the lower back? Would completing the 10-step protocol have more success? Is there a step I need to insert? Is my knowledge too limited to deal with FM using CST? If so, I can refer out although I hate to do so as she's only had 2 - 30 minute sessions so far and I'd like to see a few more sessions to see cummulative effect.
Each difficult moment has the potential to open my eyes and open my heart. --Myla Kabat-Zinn

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Post by AnastasiaB » Thu Jun 05, 2008 7:55 pm

Speaking from my own personal experience w/ Fibromyalgia and CST -- it is one of the few techniques that really helps my body and my mind unwind at the same time. The gentility of it and the strength of it can help you do some really phenomenal work.

As for what may or may not have happened with your client, there have been occasions when I have had similar experience with my own treatment, and it often times because there is so much "stuff" going on with my body and/or mind that it adds weirdness to the equation.

TRUST YOUR GUT INSTINCTS WITH THIS AND IT WILL BE OKAY!!! I say that as one who trusts her LMT to use CST as her instincts guide her and it works well for me... even on those days when my body is a bit more "wonky" than I realized outwardly.


fwiw...
J
Anastasia B

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Re: Fibromyalgia and CST

Post by cstbrian » Fri Jun 06, 2008 5:50 am

Hi Vita!!

It sounds to me like you did a great job. I know it stinks to go 20 minutes over in a session. But I must say, it can be difficult to only have 30 minute sessions with someone with FM. It is really ideal to have a full hour, that way if things do flare up, there's time to address them before the client leaves. (obviously my opinion - this is not set in stone)

Don't worry about your "limited knowledge". You have more knowledge than you realize!! Use your intuition to help you out. With that said, here are a few suggestions I have for you:

Make sure you perform a thorough Thoracic Diaphragm release and Hyoid release before moving to the Occipital Cranial Base (OCB). You did not cause the pain in her lower back. It sounds like she has quite a bit of compression at the OCB to bring up pain in the sacrum. Remember it's all connected. Did you stay with the OCB release until it completed or did you move to the sacrum?

Stillpoints are great! Could you get her a stillpoint inducer or show her how to use tennis balls for stillpoints? This self care will make a big difference when she comes in for sessions. The other tool I recommend is the Sacro-Wedgy. It not only helps to release the SI joints and 'free up' the sacrum, but it is like a stillpoint inducer at the sacrum.

CSTII will definitely give you more tools to evaluate and work with the body in a more specific way. However until then, you have many techniques that are very effective. If you only have 30-minutes with her, my suggestion (without evaluating her) is to do pelvic diaphragm release, L5-S1 release, and ASIS compression to free the sacral end of the dural tube. Then do thoracic diaphragm, hyoid, and OCB releases to free the dural tube at the occipital end. You may need to modify the OCB platform if it's too much for her. Once the 'ends' are free spend a bit of time doing dural tube rock and glide. A free moving dural tube is important for those with FM. (you'll learn about facilitated segments in CSTII)

If you have time to do a respiratory diaphragm release, great! But with only 30-minutes I think you'll be pressed for time. Also keep in mind that you can start with the thoracic/hyoid/OCB. That way if it brings up the sacral pain, you will be finishing the session there.

Once you've seen her for 4 or 5 sessions, you may want to check in with the cranium to see what's going on there. It's important to balance the 'body' work with the cranial work.

One final suggestion is that if the sacral pain comes up while working on the OCB, you can use direction of energy to help both the OCB and the sacrum. Use your intention to send energy down the dural tube to the spot in the sacrum that has pain. That way you are working both at the same time!

Again, it sounds like you are doing a great job. You made change in the quality of the rhythm. That means you were able to remove some restrictions so that her body's natural healing ability can be enhanced. Stick with it and I'm sure you will see positive changes.


Brian
Brian

"Life isn't about finding yourself ... life is about creating yourself." George Bernard Shaw
"When we try to control that which is out of our control, we become an incredibly anxiety prone society." Dr. John Upledger

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Vita
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Post by Vita » Fri Jun 06, 2008 10:24 am

Thank you for your feedback and encouragement! I felt a little like a fish outta water using something new for FM and while I tried not to let her know it, I wanted to be better prepared for her next session tomorrow.

She is definately not a "normal" FM case and has struggled along with her doctors to get control of it for several years so I do know there's lots of "stuff" going on. I will keep that in mind tomorrow while working.

Thank you, again! You've been a great help.
AnastasiaB wrote:Speaking from my own personal experience w/ Fibromyalgia and CST -- it is one of the few techniques that really helps my body and my mind unwind at the same time. The gentility of it and the strength of it can help you do some really phenomenal work.

As for what may or may not have happened with your client, there have been occasions when I have had similar experience with my own treatment, and it often times because there is so much "stuff" going on with my body and/or mind that it adds weirdness to the equation.

TRUST YOUR GUT INSTINCTS WITH THIS AND IT WILL BE OKAY!!! I say that as one who trusts her LMT to use CST as her instincts guide her and it works well for me... even on those days when my body is a bit more "wonky" than I realized outwardly.


fwiw...
J
Each difficult moment has the potential to open my eyes and open my heart. --Myla Kabat-Zinn

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Vita
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Re: Fibromyalgia and CST

Post by Vita » Fri Jun 06, 2008 10:35 am

I was hoping you'd have time to chime in! Thank you!
cstbrian wrote:
It sounds to me like you did a great job. I know it stinks to go 20 minutes over in a session. But I must say, it can be difficult to only have 30 minute sessions with someone with FM.
Thank you. I don't mind the 20 minutes over really. I had the time and I'm happy to do it when I can :-) I was worried about sending her out in pain. But I did suggest to her an hour session. She comes weekly and I think she's concerned about cost, but I may be able to work something out with her.
cstbrian wrote:Did you stay with the OCB release until it completed or did you move to the sacrum?
Yes, I did complete it and was just about to close when the pain got bad enough to keep her on the table. I'm assuming that I do need to be careful about making sure I hold to completion on each diaphragm? I swear I thought I was going to have to hold the sacrum for the whole 30 minutes :-)

Great idea about the stillpoint inducer! A long time ago I had a friend who specializes in CST make me one from raquetballs and a sock (the raquetballs are smaller, but not as hard as the tennis balls) so I'm going to make one to take to my client tomorrow.

Thank you again for all the wonderful tips and kind words. I will apply them tomorrow at her next session. I'll definately be going in with more confidence. I love this place! :-)
Each difficult moment has the potential to open my eyes and open my heart. --Myla Kabat-Zinn

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Re: Fibromyalgia and CST

Post by cstbrian » Fri Jun 06, 2008 12:45 pm

Vita wrote:I was hoping you'd have time to chime in! Thank you!
You are welcome!! :D
Vita wrote:Yes, I did complete it and was just about to close when the pain got bad enough to keep her on the table. I'm assuming that I do need to be careful about making sure I hold to completion on each diaphragm? I swear I thought I was going to have to hold the sacrum for the whole 30 minutes :-)
It's great that you stayed with the OCB through a release. You may find this will be necessary at each session. You'll continue to work through the layers of compression.

As far as diaphragm 'completion' goes, remember your release signs. If you get one or two releases at a diaphragm, you are good to move on. If you work too long at one diaphragm it might bring up some deep layers of restriction and maybe hard for the body to balance itself. It's not a 'horrible' thing to be too long or to have a lot of release at one particular diaphragm, but I find with FM a balance is needed. You'll learn additional techniques in CSTII on how to release energy cysts. Sometimes I can be working on one energy cyst for 30-40 minutes. But I always leave time to do some balancing work before I finish. Those are things like dural tube work, stillpoints, OCB release, sphenoid decompression. Once you 'learn' arcing in CSTII, you'll know where you need to work to help balance the session.

I put 'learn' in quotes because I believe most bodyworkers already do this, we just give it a formal introduction and a formal name. It's the best evaluation tool to have for any type of bodywork you do; especially CST.
Vita wrote:Great idea about the stillpoint inducer! A long time ago I had a friend who specializes in CST make me one from raquetballs and a sock (the raquetballs are smaller, but not as hard as the tennis balls) so I'm going to make one to take to my client tomorrow.
I went to Target and bought a package of athletic socks (the long ones) and a bag of tennis balls. I keep them in the office to give to clients as self care tools. Both for stillpoints and self massage techniques. I mention using raquetballs if the tennis balls feel too firm. I've debated keeping stillpoint inducers to sell. But the tennis/raquet balls work so well, I'd rather just give them as a freebie.
Vita wrote:Thank you again for all the wonderful tips and kind words. I will apply them tomorrow at her next session. I'll definately be going in with more confidence. I love this place! :-)
Keep us posted with your progress. And thanks for your post!

Brian
Brian

"Life isn't about finding yourself ... life is about creating yourself." George Bernard Shaw
"When we try to control that which is out of our control, we become an incredibly anxiety prone society." Dr. John Upledger

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Post by mtnlionz » Fri Jun 06, 2008 1:47 pm

This is all so good to read, and I for one sure appreciate Brian's expertise. Maybe this has been addressed in the past, but I just want to run an idea past admin:
What about a section on CranioSacral work like we have on MFR? There are at least a few schools of thought/training represented here by BWOL members. I, for one, practice it a great deal and come from a different training than the Upledger model. Might be a good way to foster community and share our differences and similarities.

Sorry for the brief hijack~

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Post by Vita » Sun Jun 08, 2008 8:16 am

Update:

My client didn't come in yesterday, but sent her husband in to take her appointment. Fortunately he had issues with which I knew exactly how to deal and had a very successful appointment.

I did talk to her via phone and got some interesting feedback. She came to me with pain dominantly on her Right side - especially in the typical tenderpoints (particularly OA, neck, shoulders and medial/sup sacrum). She told me that this pain decreased, however she had pain for 4 days in her left side (the side I kept getting drawn to using both CST and LDT). We discussed possibilities and things we discussed here and when she comes next week I'm going to show her how to do the stillpoint and try CST again. She's frustrated, disappointed and may have had some unreal expectations about this work (and LDT for that matter), so I hope we can move past that to continue to work on this a little bit longer to see at least some results.

Much thanks to you all again for the feedback and encouragement. You are an amazing and priceless resource!
Each difficult moment has the potential to open my eyes and open my heart. --Myla Kabat-Zinn

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naturalrehabofvtca
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Nothing I've seen is better than Profascia 2000 for Fibro!!!

Post by naturalrehabofvtca » Sat Jul 05, 2008 4:26 am

I discovered this product 9 years ago and have recently begun teaching classes in California and Vermont to get it out there because, I'm tired of being the only one in the country that uses this stuff. When I first found it I was sceptical of course because the lady that designed it claimed that without massage, all she was doing was putting it on and it got rid of her very severe Fibromyalgia and Chronic Fatigue. I had to see it work to become a believer. It got rid of my chronic tennis elbow and carpal tunnel in three topical applications. I was so impressed that a colleage of mine (now my wife) and I had them fly out and show us how it worked. We brought in some of our toughest cases and it was getting rid of with one application (I'm not exagerating) TMJ the kind that you need a mouth guard for, Restless Leg, Chronic Joint pain, Carpal Tunnel, and much more. I was most impressed when my wife brought in someone she had known for 10 years that had been suffering from Parkinsons, MS, and Muscular Dystrophy for almost that long. He was in bad shape, I've never seen someone this bad that wasn't bedridden. This guy was a fighter. He came in barely able to move one leg in front of the other and had his mother on one arm and his daughter on the other. He flopped like a fish even after they layed him on the table. I was so distraught that I asked how he slept at night. They replied with heavy tranquilizers. I want to assure you that I'm not exagerating when I tell you that the shakes were gone in 30 min. when the creators Husband and Wife were lathering this stuff all over his body. There was not a dry eye in the room when the man got up from the table 90 min. later and walked unassisted and you couldn't even tell he had a problem. This stuff blew my mind. I quickly emptied my bank account and bought as much as I could afford. I have been the biggest promoter and largest distributor in the world. This product is nothing short of a miracle. It is so amazing I haven't even fully tested it's cappabilities. I hope next year to do case studies with the suppervision of a PHd. If you try this product it will blow your mind I assure you. It modifies the inflamatory response so quickly that if you put it on a contusion within 30min of the impact. You can litterally watch the black and blue go away within 5 min. ussually less. contact me if you want to know more.
Bryan Bush CMT AA and AS in Sports Med.

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Post by moogie » Sat Jul 05, 2008 7:14 am

I'm sorry but this last post comes off like the sales pitch of a "snake oil salesman."

Your product may be fantastic but with claims like that and the lack of information available on your website....well, it comes off wrong.

Angie

StressSolutions

Post by StressSolutions » Sat Jul 05, 2008 8:10 pm

Moogie, I see what you mean. Brian, what is in this oil and lotion? Can you provide a little science as to how it "cures" these conditions?

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Post by AnastasiaB » Sun Jul 06, 2008 11:43 am

Vita,

Glad to hear what little I had to say gave you some help. Always glad to help when I can, if I can.

As for the lotion/oil whatever --- sounds like snake oil to me.... tried so much stuff like that that I automatically don't trust anyone who makes claims of being able to "cure" or "remedy" fibro and the like with the application of such stuff........
Anastasia B

Be who you are and say what you feel, because people who mind don't matter, and people who matter don't mind. - Theodore S. Geisel - [Dr. Seuss][

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naturalrehabofvtca
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I have nothing to prove with my so called snake oil!

Post by naturalrehabofvtca » Sun Jul 06, 2008 9:15 pm

I've seen it work so if you don't believe me it's your loss I have countless stories and testimonies from using it over the last 9 years and am tired of trying to prove the oil valid. It works and does what I say.

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Re: Nothing I've seen is better than Profascia 2000 for Fibr

Post by ccMarie » Mon Jul 07, 2008 3:37 am

naturalrehabofvtca wrote: I quickly emptied my bank account and bought as much as I could afford. I have been the biggest promoter and largest distributor in the world.
Good for you. I doubt you'll convince anyone here to do the same.
You are not on this planet to produce anything with your body. You are on this planet to produce something with your soul. Your body is simply and merely the tool of your soul.

- Neale Donald Walsh Conversations with God

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